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Moving to a bigger school and current contract

Posted by Just wondering on 12/5/2024, 9:26 am

I have the opportunity to move to a 4A currently from a 3A. Can I ask to be released on the grounds of step up promotion? Can they not release me? If you know I need advice.

Re: Moving to a bigger school and current contract

Posted by successfully did this on 12/20/2024, 9:15 am, in reply to "Moving to a bigger school and current contract"

You can certainly ask. Most administrators try not to keep someone that does not want to be there. Finding someone to fill your job after you leave will obviously be their biggest concern. If they beieve they have a plan to finish the year they may let you go. If not they have every right to not release you. If your new district really wants you they may be willing to hold the position for you.

Re: Moving to a bigger school and current contract

Posted by BDSO on 12/6/2024, 7:53 pm, in reply to "Moving to a bigger school and current contract"

If you were a head football coach, it would be no problem. This happens all the time. But, they follow a different set of rules the rest of us mere mortals don't. And, don't give me the "well, they are also athletic directors and are considered admin and not teachers". Not always, but you see them leaving in the middle of the year all the time to go to a different school.

Re: Moving to a bigger school and current contract

Posted by Mr. Dude on 12/9/2024, 5:17 pm, in reply to "Re: Moving to a bigger school and current contract"

Most schools want their Athletic directors for the next year by January. This gives them time to move staff (if needed) and set up their off season schedule. Football is a 12-months sport now. So no matter what the contract says...their jobs really are January - January...which is why the AD openings are gearing up right now.

Re: Moving to a bigger school and current contract

Posted by Buck on 12/11/2024, 9:00 am, in reply to "Re: Moving to a bigger school and current contract"

Re: Mr. Dude:
No doubt what you’re saying is true. It’s just sad that things have gotten to this point. And we’re no better. Marching shows are already being organized for next school year, and we haven’t even played our Christmas concert yet. Bah humbug.

Re: Moving to a bigger school and current contract

Posted by Me on 12/6/2024, 8:43 am, in reply to "Moving to a bigger school and current contract"

So, I have known a situation where a district would not release a teacher but the new district accepted them anyways. They just waited for their certifiction to be released the next year. The process to hold someone's contract is actually not easy for districts so most of the time they may try to hold tight on it at the beginning but in the end they will cave and let you out. It's a gamble, but it's one that you will probably win if your new employer is willing to play the game.

Re: Moving to a bigger school and current contract

Posted by Um... on 12/6/2024, 7:26 am, in reply to "Moving to a bigger school and current contract"

You can ask. Ultimately, it is up to them to release you.

Re: Moving to a bigger school and current contract

Posted by Me on 12/5/2024, 12:50 pm, in reply to "Moving to a bigger school and current contract"

There is no legal requirement for a district to move you up just because of a "step up." They USUALLY do but are not required to do so.

At this point in the year, given teacher shortages, you may not get released no matter what you do.

Re: Moving to a bigger school and current contract

Posted by Come on on 12/6/2024, 7:47 am, in reply to "Re: Moving to a bigger school and current contract"

That's always their go to line..."teacher shortage". But the reality is that unless OP is in a remote rural area, there are most likely at least 50 other people looking for a band job.

Re: Moving to a bigger school and current contract

Posted by Me on 12/7/2024, 4:32 pm, in reply to "Re: Moving to a bigger school and current contract"

Then why are there still vacancies for band jobs?

Re: Moving to a bigger school and current contract

Posted by Here's Why on 12/9/2024, 7:00 am, in reply to "Re: Moving to a bigger school and current contract"

Because our Schools of Music, with a few exceptions, constantly tell their music majors that unless a school is 3C, 5A, or 6A...the school is "beneath" them and not worth their time, and actively tell them to not apply at anything smaller. This is just to pad the colleges' egos so they can recruit and say, "Come to our school of music...our music majors get jobs at the BIG schools".

Re: Moving to a bigger school and current contract

Posted by Same on 12/10/2024, 11:22 am, in reply to "Re: Moving to a bigger school and current contract"

I went to a "big" college of music and never heard that. Not sure why of course. But I've also never had any problems getting university professors and staff to come work with my 2A band either. Usually, they are the ones who ask me if they can come work with the students and directors.

Re: Moving to a bigger school and current contract

Posted by Um.. on 12/9/2024, 1:21 pm, in reply to "Re: Moving to a bigger school and current contract"

It’s been a while since I went to college, but I never heard that a single time. In fact we did our teaching methods classes at a 3A school a half hour away. I went to NT.

I think this is projection more than fact. People think that this is sad, therefore it must be what it said.

It’s probably more accurate than a lot of people in suburban and urban areas simply can’t pick up and move to the middle of nowhere, so they don’t apply for jobs in smaller districts. Or older directors have families that also have jobs, careers, and roots in a community, so they can’t leave either.

Re: Moving to a bigger school and current contract

Posted by And... on 12/10/2024, 7:37 am, in reply to "Re: Moving to a bigger school and current contract"

...it sounds like NT is one of the exceptions that the poster above said are out there.

Re: Moving to a bigger school and current contract

Posted by Snerk on 12/11/2024, 7:31 am, in reply to "Re: Moving to a bigger school and current contract"

So then name them. Stop dancing around the topic. Who or which COM is doing this? Because I'm sure the dean of said COM would like to know their staff is denigrating school districts.

Re: Moving to a bigger school and current contract

Posted by Well... on 12/9/2024, 10:31 pm, in reply to "Re: Moving to a bigger school and current contract"

...I can speak from experience within the last 10 years.

I was at a rural 3A school within a reasonable (by TX standards) driving distance to a metropolitan area. I got the green light to hire an assistant. We were located 15 miles from one of our more prominent schools of music. I went to the band director at said school about advertising the position, and he refused to help us out and let his graduates know about a position practically on their doorstep. I asked to know why as a new graduate needs to get as many interviews as possible.

This is what he said...to my face:

"You don't understand, I don't care about small school programs. This is about me getting the graduates into the *big* schools. That makes our program look good."

Projection? Isolated incident? Doubt it.

With that said, I'm not so jaded that I think this happens everywhere (although I think it happens much more frequently than people are willing to admit) as a day or two later, a new graduate sent me their resume from another prominent music school about an hour to our south....actually in the metropolitan area that we were close to. Her school of music had no problem advertising my open position when I asked them to help spread the word. Hired them in the interview. A very good hire. She took over the program when I retired...still doing a fine job.

Funny thing, the college director that dissed me to my face couldn't figure out why I stopped asking his staff to clinic my bands (they never did...now I know why), or attending his pre-UIL marching contests; after all, we were "just down the road" from him (apparently he cared about our money).

And, yes, there are candidates who have to limit their job search for legitimate reasons; that's been true since the beginning of time. However, I find it difficult to believe that there are that many people in that situation that it puts rural schools in a bind finding directors. Administrators crying "Teacher Shortage" is a much more recent thing...and I don't buy that either. I retired two years ago, and my school was letting teachers out of their contracts left, right, and center without much issue. If there was such a shortage of teachers, no school would dare release faculty so freely.

Re: Moving to a bigger school and current contract

Posted by Me on 12/10/2024, 7:41 am, in reply to "Re: Moving to a bigger school and current contract"

Just FYI:

Teachers were being retired "left right and center" because funding was being cut. They wanted younger people in those positions because they cost less. Trouble is, most of those people haven't stayed in education. And you can't just "bring the older folks back" because they don't want to come back at first-year salaries, which our current system would require.

I work in a suburban district. There are about two dozen elementary schools in my district - each of them has MULTIPLE vacancies that they can't even get anyone to apply for, let alone fill. My kid's school in another district has a vacant second grade position and has for two months. High schools in my district have had vacancies since the first day of school - and urban districts nearby do too.

Now back to the first part of your post:

You're taking the point of view of ONE person from ONE college and applying it to people across the board. There are jerks everywhere in the world. That doesn't make everyone in the world a jerk. But if we take and accept your point, that means those young men and women being trained by those types of college directors don't seek out rural or middle school jobs because they don't see potential there.

Unfortunately I have to agree.

When was the last time an ATSSB-qualifying (C, CC, A, AA, AAA, AAAA) school got its director elected to state office in TMEA? How often is the band chair a middle school director? Until we provide an opportunity for advancement and recognition and until we visibly respect the people doing the job that aren't at the "big time" programs then people will be more inclined to work for those big time programs.

Also, the kids that go into music education - are they coming from second and third ensembles, or are they the first chair top band kids? Those kids don't even KNOW the Grade 1 list to teach it to a band. They've likely never played a piece off of it. They've only had one semester of methods, maybe two, on an instrument not their primary. They're not qualified to teach a one-man-show gig. Let 'em get some experience first.

Re: Moving to a bigger school and current contract

Posted by Contract on 12/5/2024, 11:42 am, in reply to "Moving to a bigger school and current contract"

They are not required to release you for any reason. You signed a contract. Now, some districts will release you if you can find a suitable replacement and there are circumstances such as promotion, or family issues. But, they are not required to do so - the ball is completely in their court. You can ask, but the district can do whatever it wants.

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