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AREA G CONTROVERSY

Posted by AREA G ROBINHOOD on 10/28/2024, 5:04 pm

There is evidence of two Region 15 bands having taken students out of class and rehearsing during the academic school day. These practices were held where Area G Contest took place to gain a competitive edge. Under the UIL Side by Side rules that coincide with TAC S.76.1001 Students may not miss other classes for practice. Only amount of time scheduled for class may be used for practice.

Apparently only TWO members of the UIL committee have been informed and only those TWO will be the ones to make this decision. How is this fair for anyone participating/participated this year? Is this going to be pushed under the rug until December like region 15’s UIL Secretary is trying to do? Is this gonna be a slap on the wrist for something this serious?

Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY

Posted by JQ Public on 10/29/2024, 2:04 pm, in reply to "AREA G CONTROVERSY"

This affects 4 bands. The alternate and the one below PLUS 11th and 12th place that did not make finals! They would/should have had a chance to advance.

Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY

Posted by Um on 10/29/2024, 3:09 pm, in reply to "Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY"

The top five bands in prelims were the top five bands in finals, although in a slightly different order.

Or do you mean to tell me that a band would've leapfrogged up six or seven spots?

Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY

Posted by JonQ on 11/1/2024, 10:39 pm, in reply to "Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY"

The fact that no one can guarantee the results is why it matters.

Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY

Posted by Probability. on 11/2/2024, 12:14 pm, in reply to "Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY"

A test of reasonableness vs your remedy would show highly unlikely. You can’t provide for every single what if probability.

Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY

Posted by Whatever on 11/9/2024, 5:27 pm, in reply to "Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY"

So no one should ever be held accountable for rules violations?

Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY

Posted by BK on 10/29/2024, 10:29 am, in reply to "AREA G CONTROVERSY"

What evidence? How long did they rehearse during that time?

"Something this serious" isn't as serious as it sounds unless you have the evidence and it shows actual 'serious' violations. Not every violation is serious. Most aren't. BUT...if you have more info, please share

Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY

Posted by Area G Robinhood on 10/29/2024, 12:06 pm, in reply to "Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY"

There is photographic evidence, eyewitnesses, and the hosting school has verified that they were there . Multiple principals and sups are on it already. Have plenty of info for the REAL people that need it.

Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY

Posted by So.... on 10/29/2024, 3:48 pm, in reply to "Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY"

...your first thought was to come to TYB, claim fraud, and accuse the region secretary of collusion in said fraud...instead of calling the UIL Compliance Office?

OK, got it.

Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY

Posted by No dog in the hunt on 10/28/2024, 7:39 pm, in reply to "AREA G CONTROVERSY"

1. Get a grip.

2. From the side-by-side on UIL's website: (12) May students miss class for practice at the site of a post-district athletic, academic, or fine arts contest? UIL strongly discourages any loss of school time for practice scheduled away from that school’s campus. Furthermore, TEC §33.081 (a) states, “The rules must, to the extent possible, preserve the school day for academic purposes.” This language in the statute is the basis for adopting a rule which allows for practice of an extracurricular activity for one period of the day and preserving the remainder of the school day for academics. In addition, practice is limited to one hour during the school day.

Emphasis mine. Strongly discouraged is not prohibited. Area is post-district.

Later, in the side-by-side, your protest point hinges upon:

(15) How much time may be used for practice of a non-athletic extracurricular activity during the school day? Students may not miss other classes for the purposes of practice for extracurricular academic, fine arts, or athletic activities, such as one-act plays, speech or debate contests, etc. If the student is scheduled for a class that is directly affiliated with the activity (e.g., theatre/one-act play), only the amount of time scheduled for that class may be used for practice purposes. (19 TAC §76.1001 [e] [1], [2] and [3].)

If the school has a 90 minute block schedule, and said school practiced for 90 minutes or fewer, they're perfectly in the clear.

IMO, this protest will go exactly nowhere.

Finally, this isn't why you lost at Area. It's not a controversy just because someone did something you don't like.

Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY

Posted by Follow the Rules on 10/29/2024, 11:44 am, in reply to "Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY"
Edited by board administrator 10/29/2024, 11:57 am

After reading the original post and reading your comment, you have clearly did not understand the last sentence to the rule "In addition, practice is limited to one hour during the school day". If a school has a 90 minute block, and they practiced 90 mins....they're still breaking the UIL Side by Side rule by going over an hour.

Get a grip? What about actually following the rules? If the allegations are true and there is evidence, why can't they hold up the rules for everyone? Driving from any region 15 school to where the Area G contest was is easily a 30-45 minute drive. Take into account the loading/unloading, rehearsal,etc.....it adds up to more than an hour.

So these two schools can allegedly break the rules but yet Roma HS gets disqualified for going over no more than 2 seconds? 2 SECONDS!? Why didn't anyone say get a grip to Dena when she fought about it?

No one ever wants to bring to light anything that is done wrong because "everyone does it, even the powerhouse bands". I'm glad who ever posted this did because wrong doings need to be reprimanded.

I hope that they actually do investigate this and the right thing is done. If not, then there should be no 8 hour rule, there should be to time limit rule, there should be no rule about taking them out during the day.

*REMOVED BY TYB HOST - WE AIN'T INSULTING REGION EXECS HERE*

Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY

Posted by And... on 10/29/2024, 2:41 pm, in reply to "Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY"

...you don't understand what the Side-By-Side quoted from the TAC:

only the amount of time scheduled for that class may be used for practice purposes. (19 TAC §76.1001 [e] [1], [2] and [3].)

If they are scheduled in a class that meets in a 90 minute block, they are good to rehearse for 90 minutes.

As "Respectfully" asked, is there an ensemble on a 90 minute block out there that only rehearses for 60 minutes? While an interesting question, it is actually irrelevant...if the class is scheduled for 90 minutes, even if the director chooses to only use 60 of those minutes, the class continues for another 30. Therefore a band can go out and practice the full 90.

A band in that situation is following the rules...period. Now, there is an unused grip on the table...go get it.

Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY

Posted by Actually on 10/30/2024, 10:14 am, in reply to "Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY"

The rule further states that no more than 300 minutes of class time can be used toward the extracurricular component (i.e. marching band) within the school day.

So, if a band class is single-blocked at 90 minutes, they will be fine to rehearse the entire period.

If a band class is double-blocked at 90 minutes, there must be other components involved for the other 150 minutes of the week.

Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY

Posted by Respectfully on 10/29/2024, 1:44 pm, in reply to "Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY"

Is there a single school with 90 minute double-block scheduled classes that only rehearses their band for 60 of those 90 minutes?

Even one?

Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY

Posted by I thought on 10/29/2024, 2:40 pm, in reply to "Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY"

I thought that block schedule schools stay compliant because they spend 30 minutes of the 90 minutes working on skill building/fundamentals, drill team tune etc. and the remaining 60 on the competitive marching band program.

Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY

Posted by Umm on 10/29/2024, 5:20 pm, in reply to "Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY"

I can think of several high schools that have blocked band classes and use the entire time on the marching show.

Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY

Posted by Yep on 10/30/2024, 6:41 am, in reply to "Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY"

That's because the rule in question doesn't count time spent on the marching show in *class* on a daily basis. It counts the total amount of minutes within a school week that a band is allowed to practice in *class* (like how our conference period time is allocated). As long as a band doesn't go beyond the allocated amount of *class* time within the specified time frame...you're good.

Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY

Posted by opportunity knocks on 10/29/2024, 10:41 am, in reply to "Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY"

With this clarification next year everybody’s doin' it.

Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY

Posted by Snerk on 10/29/2024, 11:56 am, in reply to "Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY"

This isn't news. Some bands have been doing this for years.

And for what it's worth - One-Act Play has been doing this literally as long as there's been a contest. Even at the district level.

Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY

Posted by Ha on 10/29/2024, 1:23 pm, in reply to "Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY"

You took the words out of my mouth: OAP!

Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY

Posted by Mr. Dude on 10/29/2024, 1:12 pm, in reply to "Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY"

Yes…and OAP schedules that for EVERY SHOW at the contest. Not just for the host school’s friends.

Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY

Posted by So.. on 10/30/2024, 7:22 am, in reply to "Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY"

What’s stopping you or anyone else from calling the host school and asking to have a practice there?

Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY

Posted by Mr. Dude on 10/30/2024, 9:47 am, in reply to "Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY"

Also...it's not allowed in Area D

“No school or competing organization is permitted to secure, or in any way, use the Area D contest performance stadium for any rehearsal or performance at any time within a minimum time period of 30 days prior to the UIL Area D Marching Contest at that facility.”

Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY

Posted by Respectfully on 10/30/2024, 1:38 pm, in reply to "Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY"

That rule's flat out not enforceable.

Area D has area contests at the following sites:

Pflugerville Stadium
Heroes Stadium in San Antonio, serving NorthEast ISD
Rocket Field in Robinson
Groesbeck Stadium in Groesbeck

That rule, as written, means that a band CANNOT perform at THEIR OWN FOOTBALL GAMES for a month prior to area. Since every single one of those stadium locations is a HOME FIELD for at least one school in that area, it's simply not enforceable.

While I'm sure some of the band directors within Robinson, Groesbeck, Pflugerville, and Northeast ISDs - and their opponent schools - would LOVE to not have to do football games for a month, the reality is that it's .. not reality.

If you follow the rule as written, the second they take the field to march halftime, they've "used the contest performance stadium for Area D marching contest" for a performance. They should all 100% be DQ'd. That takes .. fifteen-twenty bands out of area competition at Area D, including multiple finalist bands.

It's a worthless rule and can't be enforced.

Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY

Posted by Mr. Dude on 10/30/2024, 2:47 pm, in reply to "Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY"
Edited by board administrator 10/30/2024, 2:49 pm

**REMOVED BY TYB HOST DUE TO PERSONAL ATTACK. ONLY WARNING. IP ADDRESS WILL BE BLOCKED IF THIS PERSISTS**

UIL AREA D MUSIC EXECUTIVE COMMITTEE RULE
CONCERNING USAGE OF CONTEST STADIUM
PRIOR TO ANY UIL AREA D MARCHING CONTEST
The UIL Area D Executive Committee’s intent is to ensure and maintain
equity for all competing organizations. Also, to ensure that no
organization or school should be given any opportunity that could create
a real or perceived advantage over any other competing organization.
This rule states that:
“No school or competing organization is permitted to secure, or in
any way, use the Area D contest performance stadium for any
rehearsal or performance at any time within a minimum time period
of 30 days prior to the UIL Area D Marching Contest at that facility.”
This rule is a specified “local ground rule” as authorized in the UIL
C&CR Subchapter B: Music Section 1105 (f)(7).
The only exceptions being:
1. The school(s) to which that performance facility serves as their
“home stadium”.
2. If an organization is competing in a competition hosted by the
“home school” (i.e. football game).
3. If the “home school” hosts a pre-UIL marching contest in that
facility, the competition must be well publicized and made
available to EVERY competing organization that will be
participating in that Area D marching competition. Attendance
must be open, and may not be limited to any particular
organizations or group of participants.
The Area D Executive Committee voiced their opinions and justifications
based on their feelings that no competing school should be afforded any
advantage over any other competing school. Obviously, every
competing organization would not be able, financially, geographically, or
otherwise, to rent or utilize the performance facility for rehearsal
purposes. Therefore, the UIL Area D Marching Executive Committee
unanimously voted that no organization should be allowed to do so.
(Approved 9/26/2017)

Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY

Posted by Mr. Dude on 10/30/2024, 9:22 am, in reply to "Re: AREA G CONTROVERSY"

Well...my area contest was 4 hours away...so that's stopping me.

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