: Danny has gotten overlooked by a lot of people
: but I think it's cause they focus on the
: kung fu and not the fist. In the MU I'd say
: only Shang Chi and the Immortal Weapons are
: anywhere near his class and with Danny's new
: power levels Shang Chi wouldn't survive a
: prolonged fight. The DCU has had more of a
: committment to developing its martial
: artists and sans fist, I'd say Lady Shiva,
: Connor Hawke, and Batgirl might be his
: equals. Do I think Danny could beat Batman
: and Nightwing. Nightwing maybe, without the
: fist, and it'd be a hard fought battle.
: Batman? No way, the stupid Karate Kid fight
: aside. Batman would hold his own for as
: long as it takes to find some flaw to
: exploit, which he'd more than likely find
: more in Danny's personality than skill or
There is no way Batman can even come close to Iron Fist without prep and tech. This is mot me being biased towards my favored character either.
Elite martial artists at Marvel (with the notable exception of Karate Kid) have always been portrayed on a far higher level and far more "over the top" than at DC. As a young martial arts student back in the '70's, I was one of the few who actually collected the Richard Dragon series. He had trouble with journeymen boxers (and stated Ali in his prime would beat him) and was fought to a draw by some student of Bruce Lee. Dragon, along with Shiva are still the elite of DC's MA's and w/o tech and prep, above Batman and Nightwing.
By contrast, even pre-power up, Danny (though with only peak human stats) was able to shatter steel (by his normal strikes, not the IF) and dodge bullets by moving faster than the bullet. I know that Batman, Nightwing and countless other characters in comics evade bullets all the time, but very few actually outmove them. Danny (and Davos) have humbled and outclassed superhumans like Spiderman by fighting skills alone in hand-to-hand combat. Batman is just not anywhere near that level. In Marvel other elite MA's like Mantis have managed to KO Thor and the "Master of the World" KO'ed Namor. Like I said, only certain incarnations of KK has ever been written over the top like this.
Since his power up, Danny's senses are greatly enhanced, his speed/reflexes are WELL into the superhuman levels, and his (non-IF) striking force is great enough that when he and (when his prowess and powers were greatly enhanced by Crane Mother) Davos collided kicks, the force of the shockwave blew out the windows on that floor of the building. So even with just his enahnced stats and skill, Danny is SO FAR above Batman there is no comparison. They are simply writen on completely different levels.
I'm even going to go one step further and state my real (educated) opinion about DC elite MA's. I really don't think that many of them would be able to beat some real world elite MA's if you threw them in some Muay Thai shorts and in the ring or cage based on their "average" portrayal. I know that they do have some over the top feats and there is the suspension of disbelief factors to contend with. A real MA would not heal the same way from a knee or shoulder injury, ect. the same way or wade through a hail of bullets unharmed (ala LAST ACTION HERO). But just looking at pure close quarters combat, most comic book writers don't even have enough of a clue about what really is possible to write an elite martial artist with any accuracy. IMO, there are several guys out there that barring tech and prep would beat Bruce Wayne, Richard Dragon, Dich Grayson, or Connor Hawke in a straight fight. I could not even imagine the same of the current Danny Rand (though Jo Duffy's version would go down).
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