Posted by Johan on 10/11/2011, 16:49:11, in reply to "Re: equal treatment"
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France was first presented with a potential female sovereign when Jean I died. His halfsister Jeanne was still a minor and as her mother Margaret of Burgundy had been involved in an extra-marital affair she was surpassed by an adult uncle and she only inherited Navarre (another kingdom in what now is France that knew female succession).
When the last of son of Philip IV (Charles IV) died only their sister Isabella remained. She was married to the King of England and her son Edward III claimed the throne. During the 100 year war French lawyers came up with the Salic law. So the first time a woman could really have succeeded she had allready married a foreigner and her son and heir was king of England.
An situation the French found unacceptable. So they prefered the alternative male line.
After that the rule stuck troughout the rest of the Ancien Regime even though Philip II of Spain tried to have his daughter Isabella from his marriage with Elisabeth of Valois succeed Elisabeth's brother Henri III. By then the Salic law was allready in existance so she had no real change.
Neither did Marie-Therese-Charlotte, when her brother died it was her uncle Louis XVIII and not she who nominally succeeded. This was followed later in the 19th century when her nephew Henri, count of Chambord died he was not succeeded by his sister's son. Even though Louise d'Artois had married into the Parma-branch of the Bourbons.
The German monarchies had individual rules and were not all excluding women that is why i feel they would have introduced male-preffered or even gender neutral succession by this age if the monarchies had continued.
--Previous Message--
: --Previous Message--
: France did not want female succession to
: prevent a foreigner becoming lord and master
: in the country. That is the basic sentiment
: underlining the Salic law of succession.
:
: But that in turn presupposes the assumption
: that a princess has married a foreigner. It
: certainly would not be an issue, if she
: married a native Frenchman. Of course, that
: usually implied that her husband was a
: commoner or a noble -- unthinkable.
:
: Well: xenophobia is an understandable
: concern. In other countries, where females
: had succession rights, compromises were
: reached regarding the status of foreign
: royal males. In the first place, a princess
: who was close in line to the throne would
: typically marry a cadet prince, or a junior
: member of a foreign royal house -- too far
: down in the succession for it to matter,
: should a conflict of interests arise.
:
: Secondly, a foreign royal prince sometimes
: would renounce his succession rights and get
: incorporated into the royalty of his wife's
: country (e.g. Bourbon Spain, which had
: Infantas marry Bavarian princes who got
: created into Infantes).
:
: But apparently France afforded little such
: flexibility and compromise ...
:
: In Germany gender is also less determining
: in what someone can or can't do. So a female
: sovereign is not unlikely. The last male
: heir of the house of Anhalt has allready
: made it clear his oldest daughter will
: succeed him in his role as head of their
: family. Austria's most reverred and
: succesfull sovereign is Maria Theresia. So
: the reign of an Empress Maria Theresia II
: would be welcomed like the reign of
: Elisabeth II was in England.
:
: Let's not forget that Germany was not even
: united until the 1870's. Prior to
: unification, you had various independent
: states with different succession laws. And
: you'll notice that the German monarchies
: were, on the whole, less discriminatory
: against women than the French (whether royal
: or imperial). Consider that Bavaria,
: Hanover, and Wuerttemberg all operated under
: the semi-Salic law (not as male-restrictive
: as the pure Salic).
:
: I believe Austria and Bourbon-Two Sicilies
: also operated under semi-Salicism (hence,
: the accession of Maria Theresa, although her
: husband was the one who got elected as Holy
: Roman Emperor). Like Germany, Italy also
: was a set of distinct independent
: city-states -- each with its own set of
: succession rules.
:
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