Posted by M.Sjostrom on 23/10/2009, 10:01:14, in reply to "Re: Papal Princes"
82.181.239.182
one of customs of Italian nobility has been that IF the House (the head) holds several princely and/or ducal titles (something they usually do, at least in older houses), then his younger sons and brothers may enjoy the courtesy honorific of duke or prince (however usually without name of a specified dukedom or princedom; rather as honorific and with their usual surname), this is technically thought to be based on a temporary family division of titularies and 'rights'.
Then, another matter is those houses whose some title comes from the Holy Roman Empire. As is with the HRE titles, such title and rank belongs rightfully to all agnates - which is somewhat contrary to Italian (southern) customs where primogeniture is emphasized with titles. However, those HRE titles could be used also by younger sons, brothers, and all agnates.
There are entire houses who use 'marchese', or 'conte', or even 'principe', on basis of a HRE title belonging to their house.
All this goes -and often quite legitimately- against the over-simplified idea of *all* italian cadets of noble houses being 'only' something like: don, dei principi di...
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btw, an ignorance of the existence of the princely house of Borghese is very telling.
It should not be that easy of anyone having even a bit knowledge about royalty, to have avoided for example the fact that Napoleon's sister Pauline married a prince Borghese.
--Previous Message--
: During the ancien regime there were many noble
: families in the Papal States (probably in a
: ratio comparably similar to many other
: states, including France), but I do not
: think there were that many princes.
:
: This is a list of the families who enjoied
: the title of "Principe Romano"
: (strictly linked to the city of Rome): some
: are extinct, like the Bonaparte (descendants
: of Lucien, prince of Canino), but I cannot
: exclude that rare other families from other
: cities might have received a princely title
: from the pope:
:
: Aldobrandini
: Altieri
: Barberini
: Bonaparte
: Boncompagni Ludovisi
: Borghese
: Chigi
: Colonna di Paliano
: Colonna di Sciarra
: Corsini
: Doria
: Ludovisi Boncompagni
: Principe di Montholon
: Odescalchi
: Orsini
: Pallavicini
: Rospigliosi
: Ruspoli
: Santacroce
: Strozzi
: Conti
: Torlonia
: Del Drago
: Gabrielli
: Massimo
: Spada
:
: Of course, as those families may have
: various members there is a tendency in Italy
: as well as in the US to call all of them
: princes (instead of "Don X of the
: princes of Y"), so this may give the
: impression that there are more.
:
: --Previous Message--
: There was a reality based TV dating show
: where women were competing to date an
: Italian prince and he was not from a family
: which I had ever heard of.
:
: You are referring to Prince Lorenzo
: Borghese. Are you sure that you have not
: heard of the House of Borghese? They had an
: enormous influence on art and architecture
: in Rome.
:
:
:
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